JOAN: What were some of your main findings?

ASSENY: The new program covered three aspects: home economics, agriculture and crafts, which means vocational training. And our main findings were that most of the women's groups were in the home economics. Few were in agriculture although they are the main participants in agricultural activities. The main conclusion was that the new program was implemented in a sex-stereotyped manner. Also we found that women participating in adult education were working under very strenuous and oppressive conditions. We found that they were overburdened and the overburdening hindered them from effectively participating in the program. Their participation was irregular and this actually shortened their time and prevented them from realizing a lot out of the program. We also found that the women were in economic struggle. They were exploited. They had no means of acquiring income. And they have no control over the means of production which means they have no economic power. Adult education, even the new program, has not achieved enough to give women community power. The division of labor in the rural areas also hindered women's participation whereas men had more spare time to either participate in adult education or in adult social activities. Women were left with the traditional roles - production for sustenance of life and the reproduction of children. On the whole we felt that women looked at adult education as a tool which would bring them advancement and change.

JOAN: Which women would be involved in adult education? Do a lot of women go for literacy classes or just a few? How is it organized?

ASSENY: Actually from when we launched the literacy campaign in 1970, the records showed that the majority of participants were women.

JOAN: Are the classes voluntary?

ASSENY: It's not forced but media persuade people to join literacy and adult education classes. And women in the rural areas come forward to join them. According to my research, women find that being literate will give them a lot of benefits - like they will know how to write their names. Some say they will be able to go to the bank and bank their money. Some say that it will be a chance for them to send their crops to farmers' co-operatives and sell their crops in their own names. Women have joined adult education for different reasons but the majority have been attracted to the program.

JOAN: Women more than men?

ASSENY: Yes, but the trend in the SIDA project has been that a lot of women come in on the lower level which is very preliminary, teaching functional literacy in reading, writing and arithmetic. Then we put on other levels. The women have become fewer and fewer as the levels advance.

JOAN: Would they offer it just a few hours a day in the evening?

ASSENY: The organization differs from place to place. But groups decide on what times to meet - women preferred to meet at 4 and 6 o'clock so that they would have time to complete their family responsibilities.

JOAN: So women have separate classes?

ASSENY: No . In Tanzania women and men are in the same class.

JOAN: Did you recommend continuing that in your report?

ASSENY: In the study we said that in vocational training men and women should be together. They should be taught things like cutting trees and masonry together because they were together in the basic literacy. But when they advance into the new functional program, they are not separated. Men were found in the vocational training and women in home economics. We have recommended that, where possible, they come together.

JOAN: How do you get to the men? In the literacy class?

PATRICIA: Through the literacy class. We hope that if we restructured the class it would no longer be segregated. The women themselves have said again and again, "you can't educate us alone. Don't teach us about family planning, teach our husbands. Educate our men because you can tell us to feed our families better, but we don't have control of the resources." It has to be a joint effort, co-operation between them.

JOAN: At what age are women attracted to the literacy classes?